Tactics Skills - What do we have and what are we missing?

Hi guys,
this is a pre-character creation query that could help to benefit everyone.

As I seem to have been shoe-horned into a command role (not that I mind) I want to make sure my character has the best tools to benefit the group. I'm going to take at least Command as one of my starting skills, but I realised making people do what I want is no good unless I have a good plan to start with!

To that end, I was going to bung a Tactics skill on, but I realised when talking to Dan that if someone else in the group already had the one I took, it would be wasted, as I can just ask that Marine for their tactical assessment instead of having to know it all myself.

So, instead of just picking a Tactics set, I figured I should ask which ones people's characters already have, then I can pick one which we don't already have.

In case anyone needs them to reference, the options are:

• Air Combat
  
• Armoured Tactics
  
• Assault Doctrine
  
• Defensive Doctrine
  
• Orbital Drop Procedures
  
• Recon and Stealth

I think Dan mentioned that Memnon already has Recon and Stealth but I'll let him confirm that.

Whatever gaps we do have, I'll happily try and fill them in, as I can take them earlier and cheaper than any non-Ultra characters (only 400 for each level), but obviously if people do have them that will help greatly - and it's the sort of thing a potential commander should know anyway!

The tactics I'd say that would be of higher importance and relevance, especially in regard to most of our past missions, would either be either Assault or Defence. Although it’d be nice to get both its 800XP right there, and it could be used elsewhere (Although I've found it is getting harder and harder to spend XP the further you get to levelling up, so it could be nice to just get them out of the way). Personally I find Assault being the largest priority, but that’s just my opinion, I’m sure the others may have different thoughts.

EDIT:
You should also know there's no need to take Command as you already start with it if you're a Tactical Marine.
As for a Tactical's special ability rather than the Bolter Mastery, which looks sweet by the way, to fill a commander role then the Tactical Expertise would be a better option. Especially as the former is only available in solo mode, and if you're the commander then I assume you'll be wanting us to drop into squad mode a lot which is what the latter is all about. Although you already start with Command you could take any +10s or +20s, hell even Trained, to get past the penalties that the ability requires you to take (At least for now, until you grow in rank).

All good advice i agree with richy.

Fellowship is real important for the squad leader, it (along with all the useful command abilites ect) determines how much cohesion the squad has. Some +5's to fellowship could be a good buy depending upon what your stat is.

Don't worry, I have had a lot of time to look at the rules and I know what to take for my command purposes Instead of taking Command +10 I'm going to take the Deed Keeper of Ways, an Ultramarine specific deed which gives me Talented (Command), +10 to Codex Astartes Lore and allows me to take over command if the squad's current leader is incapacitated (which could come in handy if I'm not in command for a mission) - and of course it's 100xp cheaper than the Command +10 upgrade. I was also planning on taking Tactical Expertise as the U special ability is pretty damn good for squad buffing.

I was going to take Assault Doctrine if noone else had taken it, but this was kind of the point of this thread - I wanted to know what Tactics skills people already had so I could avoid duplication - but so far noone has told me which they have (or if they have none of them - I need to know that too)!

So, do any of you have any Tactics skills?

Preaty sure noone else has any.
Noone but Ultras can take them in all reality if i remember correctly.

Fair enough, I'll just pick the useful ones as and when I can if noone else has any.

Ultramarines certainly get them a lot cheaper and I think earlier than anyone else

Good news!

See, this is why you need an Ultramarine, I read a big book and found the information everyone missed.

In the Core Rulebook on pg 36 "Space Marine Abilities", under Starting Skills, "Tactics (choose one)" is listed.

So basically, everyone starts with one Tactics set trained! Between the lot of us we should be able to cover them all off I think - if I am to be leading, I'll be more than happy to refer to my Brothers for advice on how to best approach a given situation.

That said, I know I will get the upgrades for the Tactics skill set cheaper than anyone else, so it makes sense for me to take the most commonly used ones. To that end I will use my free choice to take Tactics (Assault Doctrine), and (unless my stats rolls mean I need to suddenly buff a stat) I'll take Tatics (Defensive Doctrine) as one of my chosen starting skills.

I've spoken to Dan and he has advised that Brother Memnon has Tactics (Recon and Stealth), so that leaves the following:

• Tactics (Air Combat)
  
• Tactics (Armoured Tactics)
  
• Tactics (Orbital Drop Procedures)
  
• Tactics (Void Combat)

Remember that some of the skill sets will help us to fight against that type as well; some of them seem obviously useful like Armoured Tactics helping to spot weaknesses in tanks' armour, but if we get strafed by an Ork Fighta, a Brother with Air Combat would be able to advise us on the best way to escape, or someone with Void Combat would be able to nominate targets for an orbital bombardment more effectively.

Obviously I can't tell you what to take but as I've said it would be better for everyone if we had the full deck to play with!

So, choose your specialty: what does your Battle-Brother know?

i know how to fight, and i can see really far... but other than that very little

adamhartnett wrote:i know how to fight, and i can see really far... but other than that very little

Spoken like a true Space Wolf.

TBH I think Adam should take the Assault doctrine as anything else is an anathema to him.

That'l be a back up for when Chris can't make it...

My first thoughts are as follows, you guys may disagree, but have a think & let us know.

Rik - Dev = either Defensive or Armour?
Ian - Tech = either void, air combat or Armour?
Me - Tac = Stealth & recon
Rob (when not GM) scout = stealth & recon
Carlo - dick = being a dack

Just remember, just because your role now is as an assault / devastator marine doesn't mean you haven't done these things in the past (or even just studied them).

Assault and Defence speak for themselves really - you are a Space Marine after all - but some of the others may be a bit more obscure.

I'll try to give you some examples:

Air Combat:
You have spent time as a pilot (or gunner) for a Thunderhawk Gunship, Land Speeder Tempest, or Storm Raven
Your home chapter (or even just company) often fights in an air mobile fashion.
You participated in a protracted war against an enemy with far superior air support.
You have crewed a Whirlwind Hyperios in the past.

Armoured Tactics:
You have driven a transport or tank whilst attached to the Armoury of your chapter.
You have fought against the Dark Mechanicus and their war-constructs.
Your chapter or company favour massed rhino and razorback assaults.
You have been led into combat by a Techmarine / Iron Priest many times and have learned armour tactics from them.

Orbital Drop Procedures:
Your Chapter or company specialise in assaults launched via Drop Pod, Thunderhawk or Storm Raven.
You have defended a planet from attacks by an enemy who deploy via Orbital drop.
You have spent time as crew for a Strike Cruiser or Battle Barge and have helped to coordinate landing actions.
After a chapter outpost was destroyed by an assault spearheaded by drop infantry your Captain ceaselessley drilled you in defending against such assaults and made you study tactics and strategies.

Void Combat:
Regular ship-to-ship boarding actions have given you knowledge of how starships are laid out and how they fight.
You have served on a patrolling Space Marine Escort ship for several years and gained intimate knowledge of spaceborne tactics.
You chapter is space-based and as such you spend as much time in space as on the ground.
You defended a Ramilies-class star fort from a numerically superior enemy fleet.

I'm happy with Defense, as a Dark Angel I shouldn't be moving for anyone, so key Defensive positioning would be key and ideal. That is unless anyone else disagrees, I'm happy to take whatever would be best suited for my character or the party.

Dan wrote:
Carlo - dick = being a dick

get it right dude...
and i allready have this its called Litany Of Hate and means the rest of the party hates life as much as i do (mutants, heretics, PSYKERS!?!)

z4carlo wrote:

Dan wrote:
Carlo - dick = being a dick

get it right dude...
and i allready have this its called Litany Of Hate and means the rest of the party hates life as much as i do (mutants, heretics, PSYKERS!?!)

I left that there just to prove how much of a dick you are x

Dick..........

I think we could do with a pilot.

how was i even missed out of the magical little list...

Anth... Psyker...aka...Antagonist!

Antoine wrote:how was i even missed out of the magical little list...

Anth... Psyker...aka...Antagonist!

Prob because you were the last GM & I forgot mate,

Like chris said, these things don't automatically give you an bonuses, but will mean you'll be able to offer good tactical advice, say should the tream be drawn into a void fight etc etc.

GM allowing for intelligence rolls for things we may need etc etc